Interview with Wanderci Silva Bueno, representative of the occupied company, CIPLA

Wanderci Silva Bueno, CIPLA representative in Venezuela, and an advisor to the workers of Sanitarios Maracay, was interviewed at the Pan-American Gathering of Occupied Factories in Joinville, Brazil. Here he offers his insight into the situation in the occupied factory and his opinion on the revolution as a whole.

Q: Wanderci, could you briefly introduce yourself?

A: I am Wanderci Silva Bueno and am presently the Cipla representative in Venezuela. My task is to carry out Project Cipla-Pequivem, the agreement between Cipla here in Joinville (Brazil) with the state Petrochemical companies in Venezuela, to begin production of finished housing units.

Q: Cipla is run under workers' control. Can we assume, that your task will to be not to limit yourself to the technical implementation of the project in Venezuela?

A: Yes. On the basis of the discussion here in Brazil we have decided to work with FRETECO in Venezuela, the revolutionary united front, which organises and pushes forward factory occupations in Venezuela. It's exactly the same in Brazil where we cannot be content to have a few factories under workers' control, but rather we organise and advise this new social movement. Today the emphasis of my work is in discussion with the trade union and the workers of Sanitarios Maracay.

Q: Sanitarios Maracay was occupied on November 14, can you tell us what has happened since then?

A: In Sanatarios Maracary many import things are happening, and it is essential that we analyse them and discuss them. The present experience of factory occupations in Venezuela, which began with Invepal and Inveval concern all those factories which have already been closed and with difficulty must be reopened. The situation is different at Sanitarios Maracay. After a hard month-long struggle with the owner the workers decided to occupy the factory and immediately, without interruption, to continue production under workers' control and from the beginning to take up the campaign for the nationalisation of the enterprise under workers' control. This is a new and important experience for the whole of the working class in Venezuela. The attraction of the situation lies in the fact that the desire for the future organisation of the factory can be formulated by the workers themselves, and the nationally favoured model of cooperatives has not come to dominate. So far the formula has been as follows: 51% ownership for the State, and 49% for the cooperative, which is formed of the workforce. In Maracay the factory has been led by the workers' committee from the beginning. They have linked their self-organisation and production with the needs and desires of the people in general and see their model as the future model of the further development of the revolution.

Q: I cannot imagine that this is taking place without opposition. Can you tell us if there has been any reaction from the local authorities?

A: The leading committee of the factory, and the trade union, have gone to the government of the state of Aragua with the demand that the supplying of the factory with water and energy, as well as with gas and electricity, should be directly from the government. At the same time we are sending a letter to the government of the Republic, well in fact to President Chavez himself, requesting that he receive a delegation from the workers of Sanitarios Maracay. The last decision that I know about, as I have been back here in Bolivia for a few days, is that on December 14 there will be a demonstration of the workers in Caracas, which will go to Miraflores (the presidential palace). We are also in contact with the Ministry of Light Industry and Commerce, particularly with the Minister Maria Christiana and with the Vice-Minister, in order to push ahead the discussions around nationalisation. In the end, I am optimistic that Chavez will not be closed to the suggestions of the workers.

Q: Sanitarios Maracay is not just any factory. The workers have been fighting for their rights for several years. How has the workers' movement reacted to the occupation of the factory?

A: The first was thing that was done after the occupation, was that contact was made with the leadership of the UNT as well as with other unions in Aragua, in order to invite them to stand in solidarity with our struggle and to take part in it. The first to respond were the unions in the drinks industry, who stand fully and completely behind us. Other unions in the UNT held some internal discussions, and the results of these discussions are of discussion themselves. Marcela Masparo and Orlando Chirinos, the main figures in the formation process of the UNT, have taken attitudes, which although different, are not very positive for the workers of Sanitarios Maracay, or for the working class as a whole. I would like to assume, that this happened on the basis of misinformation, although there are clear false assessments on the part of the leadership of the UNT. Chirinos is of the opinion, that the occupation of the factory puts the union into question. This is a big mistake, and not only in theory. Firstly the idea for the occupation of the factory was decided upon and lead by the leadership of the union of Sanitarios Maracay. In fact, it was the demand of the boss for the dissolution of the collective agreement, which in practice was not followed anyway, which would have meant the destruction of the union. It was actually the occupation of the factory which saved the trade union. On the other hand Marcela Masparo has aided those forces in the company, mainly the higher-paid workers, who for years stood close to the boss, and helped them to found a new trade union, which now aspires to hold a referendum on its recognition. This division of the trade union in the company at this time is a big mistake, since it will divide the workers in the factory. I think that Masparo and Chirinos must enter an open and democratic dialog, which corresponds to the traditions of our class. Marcela and Orlando are the two most important representatives of the UNT, and represent the two main currents. What is necessary is the establishment of a united front for expropriation, for Sanitarios Maracay, and the for the Venezuelan Revolution as a whole.

Q: FRETECO has supported since its founding the nationalisation of industry under workers' control. What is the relationship between FRETECO and the UNT?

A: FRETECO has a big task before it, and is a growing force. The leadership of the UNT should accept the invitation to hold common discussions on factory occupations. Even if there are different opinions, for example concerning nationalisation and expropriation, one can assume, that all the forces of UNT accept factory occupations as a method of struggle. Occupations concretely mean the struggle against private property of the means of production. The revolutionary position of the UNT means that this cannot be opposed. Whether this occupied factory will be nationalised, or organised in a cooperative, or self-managed, can be further discussed. The important thing is that we do not lose the occupation of the factory. Here lies an important task of FRETECO, to convince Chirinso and Masparo of the correctness of this strategy. The Venezuelan revolution would then take a great leap forward. Only through factory occupations is it possible to initiate the planning of the economy. When everyone in the UNT says: "We are revolutionaries, we are socialists, we are against the private ownership of the means of production", then I think that they will really mean it. Lets get together and take the first steps in this direction! We can remain flexible, and at each moment discuss the new forms of property. However, at the moment factory occupation movement must be pushed forward. That is a key question. FRETECO organises and unites the occupied factories, and that must be extended. In each city the structures that can coordinate the occupations with the movement and the needs of the people into a plan of action for further occupations must be established. Finally it not just a question of guaranteeing the immediate interests of the workers through the occupation of factories, it is a question of the working class putting itself at the head of the revolutionary process, and the implementation of the demands of the people. This process is tightly bound the building of the UNT. The comrades of this occupied enterprise, and I can here speak for them, understand this relationship between the strengthening of the UNT and the further development of the revolution.

Q: At the moment FRETECO organises 10-12 factories in the whole of the country. Sanitarios Maracay is not just some enterprise in the middle of nowhere. It is in Aragua, one of the centres of light industry in Venezuela and a stronghold of the peasant movement. Have you made concrete plans to continue the struggle?

A: Some comrades, representatives of FRETECO have begun the discussion on the establishment of a united front committee of the factory and land occupations. The discussions with the Peasant Front Ezequiel Zamorra have progressed quite far. The unity of the workers of the factories and the fields is a central axel of the further development of the revolution. We believe firmly that the UNT must play a central role in this, and must join in this struggle. Then we can organise a revolutionary inferno. I think that it must be recognised, that the rural workers and peasant movement, due to their position in capitalist society, need natural allies. That is the working class, which plays the lead role in the revolution. In the end it is only the working class that can decisively carry out land reform, in the form of a workers' state. Sanitarios Maracay has sparked off the discussion in Aragua: the workers' state, based on the peoples' assemblies, in which not on the working class is represented, but also the peasants, soldiers, and poor of society. Therefore Sanitarios is today the central question of the Venezuelan revolution: on the one hand a factory occupation, on the other the formation of the structures of the workers' and people's power.

Joinville, Brazil, December 11, 2006

Join us

Read More