José-Antonio Hernández was recently interviewed at the 20th Congress of the Spanish Students’ Union, which was held over the weekend of November 10-12. The Congress passed a resolution in support of the Venezuelan revolution, and José was asked his opinions on the situation in Venezuela and the work of the Students’ Union.
Could you explain to us the general situation in Venezuela at the moment?
The revolution has entered a new period. In the first period of the revolution there was a united bloc against imperialism and the oligarchy. Now the main question is the struggle between the reformists and the revolutionaries. This you can see in particular in the workers' movement, and also the presidential election campaign.
With co-management (cogestión) and the occupied factories you can see a difference between form and the content. The reformists have so far won the battle on the question of the form, for example at Invepal where 51 percent of the ownership is in the hands of the State and 49 percent is in the hands of the workers themselves. So you have workers' control (cogestión) but Inveval is the only place where the president of the factory is still a worker. For example at Invepal the workers threw out the owners and the leadership of the factory, but it didn't lead to workers' control or democracy in the factory and this has created a lot of frustration and anger among the workers towards the leadership who they feel are blocking their struggle for socialism.
The reformists say that we need to make the factories competitive and that the workers should receive a portion of the profits of the factories. Our answer to that is that the state should take over the entire factory and pay the wages to the workers etc. Because the problem is that if the occupied factories have to be "competitive" then they have to compete on the capitalist market with the multinational companies, which are too strong. Then the factories wouldn't be factories producing for the whole of society, but just a group of workers exploiting themselves.
So the reformists are changing the objective of the occupied factories from socialist objectives to capitalist ones, and trying to turn the workers into capitalists.
A national meeting of occupied factories was held by FRETECO (The Revolutionary Front of Occupied Factories), and they discussed the statutes for the factories. They want the factories to be owned by the state but under workers' control.
They also discussed how they could spread workers' control to other factories and spread the idea in the Bolivarian movement, because for the revolution to succeed it is crucial that the big monopolies, banks etc. are nationalised under workers' control.
The weak point of the revolution so far, is that the workers' movement still doesn't have a revolutionary leadership. The UNT still doesn't have a plan for the occupied factories. They consider it a secondary question. The CMR is the only organisation that supports and encourages this movement of occupied factories.
So what is the next battle for the revolutionary movement?
The next very important battle and turning point will be the presidential elections. In this field the struggle between the reformists and revolutionaries is also very clear.
The reformists are blocking all participation from below in the election campaign.
For example in Mérida there was a demonstration in favour of Chávez with 12,000 participants, with slogans like "Chavismo with Chávez" and "With Chávez against the bureaucracy". But the leader of the election campaign in Mérida called the demonstrators counter-revolutionaries (!). But he himself comes from a bourgeois party, and has blocked all campaigning on the part of the grassroots. Generally the reformists say that "we need a 'normal' electoral campaign", and that there is no need to mobilise. But we say that we cannot simply have a normal campaign, because this is not a normal situation - this is a revolutionary situation were the proletariat and the poor are struggling to gain power.
The slogan for the electoral campaign is "10 million votes for Chavéz". It could be difficult to reach this target. Chavez will probably get around 8 million votes, which would be a very good result. But the reformists can use this as an excuse, and say that the reason that we did not get 10 million votes was because the campaign was too radical, that the middle class was afraid of us etc... But this is not true, the masses are moving left, and the election will be a turning point.
Chávez has said that if the imperialists and the oligarchy continue to attack, there will be no more oil for the USA. It looks like we could be reaching a similar point that was reached in the Cuban revolution before the nationalisations - if the imperialists continue to put pressure on the revolution, the revolution will move to the left.
From December (after the elections on December 3) we will be able to see clearly the division between those who want to take the revolution to the end, and those who want it to stop - that is those who reflect the interests of the bourgeoisie.
We think that the best way to get into the Bolivarian movement, the UNT and put the working class at the forefront of the movement as well as show Chávez the way to socialism, is through the occupied factories.
The victory of socialism in Venezuela would send shock waves throughout the whole of Latin America, the Caribbean and the entire world. It will be an immense inspiration to workers and youth all over the world.
So now we are at a gathering of young people in Spain - what can the youth of the world do to support the revolution?
The Hands off Venezuela campaign has done a very good job in many countries. The campaign is a very good counterweight to the large amounts of money that the monopolies hand over to the media and the right wing in Europe to slander president Chávez, the revolution and to drum up support for imperialist aggression.
The most important thing to do in terms of support for the revolution is to organize a large movement in defence of the revolution and against the attacks of imperialism, and to struggle for socialism in all countries of the world.
The Venezuelan revolution is part of the world revolution, and we are exploited by the same capitalists and the same social order.
The Spanish Students' Union (Sindicato de Estudiantes) has played a very important role in the campaign.
So what do you think of the congress?
It is a very important congress for a very important organisation with a very high political level. For 20 years they have been conducting an important struggle for the youth and the working class, both in Spain and also around the world. The congress has just passed a resolution in support of the Venezuelan revolution. They state that they support the re-election of Chavez as president, that they will spread information about the revolution in all forums they participate in and that the Bolivarian revolution must go to the end. They also state clearly that there is a revolutionary wave sweeping Latin America and they support the formation of a Socialist Federation of Cuba, Bolivia and Venezuela, as the first step towards a socialist Latin America.
It's great to be here and see what the Spanish youth are discussing and also saying about the Venezuelan Revolution!